Online Now 719

OUInsider - Owen Field

The place for the most trusted source for reliable, accurate information on OU Sports

On this Board 380
Record: 3486 (2/3/2013)

Online now 716
Record: 4487 (2/14/2012)

Boards ▾

OUInsider - Owen Field

The place for the most trusted source for reliable, accurate information on OU Sports

Basketball & Other Sports

Men's & women's basketball, baseball, softball and other OU sports

O'Connell's Off Topic

The place for discussion on topics not related to the Oklahoma Sooners

Tickets Exchange

The place to buy, sell or trade tickets

Reply

3 cornerbacks, 2 defensive ends, and a 190 lb. linebacker*

  • soonerdowns said...

    You're right. We had plenty of cornerbacks ready to step in when Jamell Fleming got hurt and we had absolutely no personnel problems at safety this year. Plus thank God we had a couple of defensive ends ready to step in when Ronnel Lewis went down and Frank Alexander couldn't lift one arm over his head. Oh, and how about that huge push we got from our defensive tackles this past year!

    Sheesh, everyone is so sensitive right now. Bring up even the slightest question or criticism of our coaching staff and the McCarthy's of the board are quick to jump in. Just because I question our defensive personnel and coaching decisions does not mean that I am a Whorns fan or that I drink rice grain vodka while reading Mein Kampf in my spare time.

    A practical request for you: Please tell me how you feel that we had enough depth at cornerback and safety this past year. It is my opinion that an aspiring championship team should have at least one backup cornerback capable of playing at a much higher level than our third CB demonstrated this past year. I also feel that a title contender should not have to move their starting outside linebacker/nickelback to safety as their first option for a backup safety. Or, if you want to look at that player as a true safety, an aspiring contender should not have to play him at linebacker just because there is nobody else at that outside linebacker/nickelback position who can cover anybody.

    What are your thoughts? Rather than the standard "Red Scare" retort about how the coaching staff knows what they're doing and I should go back to Moscow (err Austin), how about you explain to me why it is that you feel we had sufficient depth of athletic and overall playing ability on defense this past year. I'd love to hear your analysis.

    Spot on. It's obvious to me that we've shortchanged the defense in recruiting this year regardless of whether the redshirts and others who did not play this year pan out. Just watch the BCS title game this year and ask yourself if you believe the OU defense is capable of consistently playing at that level anytime soon.

    aspensooner

  • soonerdaddy said...

    Not happy with you Soonerdowns because of last weekend exchange, but I do agree with this post. Also, I would like to see us beef the LBs but this year's recuit is 195, so screw that. Venables is killing what could be at OU.

    I would like to see us recruit a couple of 250 LB that can run 4.4 .Unfortunately they're not many of them around.

    frizz

  • DLPSOONER said...

    THIS^^^^^

    If we get better play out of the upcoming DT's. Then our defensive scheme will work A LOT better than it has. Yes this is where it all starts with Coach V's scheme. This is what gets the LB's in better position and also allows the DB's to make more plays also. IT ALL STARTS HERE! Now..... this is a big if they can come in and change the up front push!

    I also agree that we need more push from the DTs and that our scheme has been limited by the lack of consistently great play in the interior line ... however, other than the dreaded prevent defense alignment, I can't think of one defensive scheme that works well without quality DT play, i.e., it is not just OU/BV's scheme that suffers with average DT play. What we have missed the last couple of years is excellence in the interior line. We have good players, but we are accustomed to having great players. If we would have rolled out a McCoy and a healthy Adrian Taylor with this back 7, the D would have been pretty salty.

    AdamsHall

  • NNicholson said...

    We need to target more players that can come in from high school and compete (and start) immediately. It's one thing to "build them up" so they can compete after riding the bench for two years, but that philosophy hasn't exactly worked as of late.

    I want the Sooners to win as much as the next guy, but it is very alarming that we don't seem to bring in and sign the elite players lately.

    Without any injuries next year and with only the commitments we currently have, does anyone on the board feel we are a slam dunk to win the Big 12 next year? Or better yet, make the MNC game?

    If it isn't a slam dunk to say Hell Yes we'll do those things, then we aren't recruiting well enough.

    If OU is not going to win the Big XII next year, who is?

    Texas - no
    OSU - not a chance
    Kansas - not a chance
    ISU - not a chance
    Tech - not a chance
    Baylor - no, unless RGIII returns then maybe
    KSU - no
    TCU - no
    West Virginia - no

    OU will be the favorite to win the Big XII next year. I don't know that OU is a national championship contender but they will be the favorite to win the Big XII. Could OU lose some games next season? Yes but I don't see a single school in the Big XII that should be the preseason favorite other than OU.

    DenverSooner

  • DenverSooner said...

    If OU is not going to win the Big XII next year, who is?

    Texas - no OSU - not a chance Kansas - not a chance ISU - not a chance Tech - not a chance Baylor - no, unless RGIII returns then maybe KSU - no TCU - no West Virginia - no

    OU will be the favorite to win the Big XII next year. I don't know that OU is a national championship contender but they will be the favorite to win the Big XII. Could OU lose some games next season? Yes but I don't see a single school in the Big XII that should be the preseason favorite other than OU.

    Based upon this past season, we could lose to any of those schools. What about Tech at Lubbock? What about TCU in Fort Worth?

    HPSooner

  • DenverSooner said...

    If OU is not going to win the Big XII next year, who is?

    Texas - no OSU - not a chance Kansas - not a chance ISU - not a chance Tech - not a chance Baylor - no, unless RGIII returns then maybe KSU - no TCU - no West Virginia - no

    OU will be the favorite to win the Big XII next year. I don't know that OU is a national championship contender but they will be the favorite to win the Big XII. Could OU lose some games next season? Yes but I don't see a single school in the Big XII that should be the preseason favorite other than OU.

    In Vegas, OU is 10:1 odds for 2012 NC. Next is Texas at 30:1. Next closest is 50:1 - Baylor and WVU I believe.

    This post was edited by OURover on 12/28/2011 at 3:41 PM

    OURover

  • OURover said...

    You guys did know I was being sarcastic, right? 2 down votes say you didn't. :-)

    The way I read it was that you were being sarcastic. I get your drift. Let the coaches evaluate the players, they've been doing a pretty damn good job of it. A lot better than some of the posters on this board could. But, I do like the way you put it.

    JetDoc

  • tyresooner said...

    I think it reflects an overall philosophy that we can win the Big12( or whatever it will be called) w/o great DT and w/o big LB's and that will get us to the BCS championship game and there maybe our offense will out score the opponent.

    You have to win your league first to get your shot and to do that in the Big12 you have to be able to COVER, at least that is what I feel is the belief at OU.

    It is kind of the situation the Big 10 is in. To win in their league you have to be really big upfront and at LB but when they get against the offensive speed of the SEC the get exposed

    We are just the other way around we get exposed as being too light and get run over.

    I think that is why the SEC wins they can play both ways on defense and both ways on offense( fast or powerful) because of the abundance of athletes they get in the south.

    I think the goals for OU are in this order

    step 1 beat Texas step 2 Win the Big 12 step 3 Get to a BCS game Step 4 Get to the BCS Championship Game

    I am with you it is alarming that we are getting roasted on defense 3 or 4 times a year and yet we just keep stockpiling WR and DB that we beef up to play LB abd LBs that we beef up to play DE.

    I wish we did it the other way around get DT that are fast enough to play DE, DEs that are fast enough to play LB LB that are fast enough to play DB.

    Sorry tyre, winning your league isnt a pre-req. Not even an unwritten one.

    There is nothing more dangerous in this world than a man with nothing to lose.

    bruthaman

  • soonerdowns said...

    It is my opinion that an aspiring championship team should have at least one backup cornerback capable of playing at a much higher level than our third CB demonstrated this past year.

    who was the third corner on our 2000 NC team? anyone? without looking it up? i bet 95% of you guys don't remember because we didn't have any injuries to thompson or strait that year and didn't need a 3rd QB to step in. i just point this out because apparently an aspiring championship team should have at least one backup cornerback capable of playing at a much higher level than our third CB demonstrated this past year. modify this to say "in case of injury".

    jeremy

    signature image

    Los Angeles Rams Fearsome Foursome

    SoonerSons

  • HPSooner said...

    Based upon this past season, we could lose to any of those schools. What about Tech at Lubbock? What about TCU in Fort Worth?

    nobody thought OSU would win the conference this year, some people even thought they'd have 4 losses... so to predict something like this so far ahead of time doesn't make sense. but remember, the big 12 can still be won even with a loss in lubbock or fort worth.

    playing in lubbock has always been dicey, just like college station has been... i'm relieved we no longer have to go there, fort worth won't be nearly as daunting. now morgantown, on the other hand...

    jeremy

    ps. to post on-topic, i'm no recruiting expert but in this conference you have to recruit to stop the other offenses, and it probably tough to land top-notch interior lineman in a league that throws the ball like crazy. but to echo what some other posters have stated, when we have great DT play, our defense is usually pretty stout (2001-2003 with tommy harris, 2009 gerald mccoy).

    signature image

    Los Angeles Rams Fearsome Foursome

    SoonerSons

  • I think the op's concerns can be illustrated by a small comparison:

    2012 Alabama class:

    ILB 6-4 245lbs 4.66 forty
    OLB 6-3 215lbs 4.55
    OLB 6-4 235lbs 4.66
    S 6-4 215lbs 4.6

    2012 OU class
    Safety/LB 6-1 195
    2 DE's that are lighter and slower than the above LBs
    Few of the LB's we have match up to that now, and certainly not when they were recruited... yeah they bulked up but they also have a tendency to get injured as well..

    MDS00NER

  • soonerborn26 said...

    Look at Corey Nelson's weight when he came in from highschool he was 195 maybe 200. Point being that OU can obviously beef these kids up, and coach them to be great players! Not to mention that he was named to the SI AA team. He may not be highly rated but is a great player.

    I like Nelson as a player, but he's seriously overmatched against the run. I don't know what his weight is listed as, but it's not enough to play SS lb.

    OU_ATL

  • frizz said...

    I would like to see us recruit a couple of 250 LB that can run 4.4 .Unfortunately they're not many of them around.

    Probably only one left after drug testing...lol

    oufisherman

  • oufreak11 said...

    My thoughts are....There are plenty of players waiting in the wings, they have talent but needed more development....Usually by next year these kids make the jump....As for DE, we can already see there was a need there with the signing of two JUCO DE and one of them being AA....At the same time Grissom fell into a funk for whatever reason.....There was depth just not difference makers like alexander or lewis.....Gabe Lynn is a good not great CB....but might be better served playing behind Hurst...He has skills but he just doesn't look very fast....sounds like Smitty could fix that.....We see the coaches got one JUCO CB to compete for the job...My opinion is he will get it...Moving Colvin was not a fault of having no CB, it speaks for how good Colvin really is....Proctor is senior and played a bunch....to me that move made sense.....as for your comment about jefferson maybe your overlooking the fact of how good jefferson is rather than what our lack of depth is....no one could have expected harris to have the issues he did being how well he played as back up the year before....I think its fair to say the coaches made a mistake by not having jefferson there from the beginning and just trying to find someone else who could play NB but I also think its fair to say that Harris was experienced and capable....It would not surprise me if Harris won his job back or was moved to NB/SLB....We could also see a little more zone next year.....The spring should be very interesting to see what the coaching staff does....

    OUFreak not trying to call you out, just making a point against a theme that seems to be prevalent of late.

    The idea that Smitty can take any athlete that the coaches previously evaluated and recruited as a premier athlete (at least we assume) and quickly or dramatically improve their speed is flawed. There are some cases were an athlete has bad form, doesn't know how to get off the line, create seperation or has not fully developed were this is possible. But, to even drop two or three-tenths in the 40 times, neverless football speed (they are different) is a tough and highly dedicated road. This far beyond the common recruit that most Division 1 schools get...they are kids after all. Also, when athletes are that fine-tuned they are more prone to injuries (hammies, etc...) due to small imbalances in their musculature. Just think about some of our fastest athletes from the past and the propensity of hamstring and leg injuries. It is part of the burden of great speed. Lastly, most are born with great speed (genetically larger amount of fast-twitch fibers), not Smittied into it. just saying...

    This post has been edited 7 times, most recently by Sooner4OU on 12/29/2011 at 1:13 PM

    signature image signature image signature image

    Proud Member of the Sooner Nation

    Sooner4OU

  • One thing that youneed to know about that 190 lb. linebacker is that he is one HELL OF A FOOTBALL PLAYER. I would say he is in the top 5 linebackers in the country.

    JRAM

  • Stoops' track record speaks for itself! Seven Big XII championships! Enough said.

    HTown

  • HTown said...

    Stoops' track record speaks for itself! Seven Big XII championships! Enough said.

    Well said HTown. Stoops record speaks for itself

    allgonzo