O'Connell's Off Topic

Hmmm...I've been gone a couple of months off this board but I see little has changed. Still not many Christians posting. Christians are still supposed to be in the majority in our country (I think) and yet our society is still ruled and dominated by carnal Christians and unbelievers.

Remember what Jesus said..."If you deny Me before men I will deny you before the Father". Apathy and disengagement will not suffice when we have to give an account.

Let the kingdom of heaven be your reality and live as did Moses who rejected the treasures of the earth considering them rubbish compared to the honor and the treasures of the sufferings of Christ (which is the loss of the soul life and it's attachments and infinity to the world).

It's a real shame and an indictment on human decency when so many people would rather talk about TV trivia, gossip and crows than to offer up a prayer of support for a dying mother.

The TRUTH ... "where your treasure is, there your heart will be also."

"godman", I'm just gonna come right out and say it. You are pushy as hell and it'd be nice if you'd back off a bit.

I am a Christian and I love the lord with all of my heart. I trust in the name of Jesus Christ, but you are forcing, and forcing, and forcing your thoughts and faith on everyone in such of a way that it is actually pushing people further and further away from the very thing that you are trying to shall I say, PIMP.

Have you not learned anything in church? Don't wear your faith on your sleeve!!! Set an example through your actions in person.

I'm begging you, as a Christian, STOP! It's ok to spread the word of God, but what you continue to do is doing people of our faith NO GOOD!

godman, Jesus said the most important thing we can do is to love God. The second most important is to love OUR NEIGHBOR. Ask yourself if you are TRULY communicating the LOVE OF GOD with what you are saying about people here.

Seriously, let's list the insulting words you spewed out all over this thread about people: carnal, apathetic, disengaging, shameful/indecent, you made an embarrassingly broad generalization about churches (mine is gospel-centered and LOVING, thank you very much), and finally told someone that he would have opposed Jesus.

Despite what you say, these long-winded ranting threads are not bold proclamations of your faith. Go to Afghanistan or Somalia, places that truly need the cross and share the gospel, THAT would be a bold proclamation of your faith as well as valuable service to God. Hiding behind your keyboard and judging others is simply hateful and does not stir anyone's affections for Christ.

You are not Christ nor do you speak with the apostolic authority of Paul, Peter, or the others. So, how about you humble yourself and approach people as a brother in Christ, and not as someone who clearly thinks he's better than others?

edit: Out of curiosity, what church or denomination are you a part of?

Rebukes and discipline are not the same as blatant insults. I am sorry that you cannot understand the difference. I insulted you as well, but it was a defensive reaction after your posts. That doesn't excuse my actions, however, and I apologize.

Toleration is a key aspect of love. God has tolerated mankind's sins from the very beginning because of his tolerance. Granted, that toleration will not last forever. But, if God were not lovingly tolerant, mankind's history would have ended with Adam and Eve.

And where did I "insist that we only act nice to all people all the time"? Thanks for blatantly twisting my words. I am just trying to get you to understand that you can be bold in your faith without judging and insulting others. It's called respect. Iron sharpens iron; do you truly think you are above being sharpened, yourself?

Jesus called the Pharisees white washed Pharisees and rebuked Peter, yes. His words and teaching caused division. You, however, are not Jesus. You do not have his authority.

I'll leave you with 2 examples of ministry from OU. One is Brother Jed. He sits in the South Oval yelling at people as they walk by and "boldly proclaims" how he's right and above reproach and how everyone who disagrees will be condemned. Do you know how people are stirred by Christ's love through him? I don't, but I'll put big money on it being 0.

Another is the ministry I'm a part of. We approach and talk to students one on one or in small groups. We listen, with respect to what they have to say and consider their history. If their beliefs differ from ours, we don't call them carnal and immature. We tactfully explain our position. More often than not, the students respond to that positively. A lot come back to speak with us time and time again and often it results in a new brother or sister in Christ. All we because we didn't begin the conversation with an insult or judgment.

Next time you type a smart remark to someone, ask yourself, "Will this show them Christ's love, or will it just push them away?"

(And for the record, I consider you telling me that I'm ignoring the gospel, would call Jesus a trouble maker, that I need to read the Bible with a "renewed mind in your spirit", etc. as insulting. I can't speak for goodolesooner, but if you said that I would have opposed Jesus I would consider it an insult as well. )

Just as I have no idea what your motives, thoughts, etc. are...neither do you have any idea of what mine or goodolesooner's are. Therefore, you have no authority to say "You would have opposed Jesus" or "you would have called Jesus a trouble maker". And just as you have no authority to say that about us...you have no authority to say it to anyone else that YOU PERCEIVE as a "worldly, soulish Christian". And no it's not a stretch for a Christian to consider it an insult to be told that they would have openly opposed Jesus.

I am not saying you should be "be nice to all people at all times" as you said. I am simply saying to respect others who have differing opinions and you will find that they are more open to YOUR values and your beliefs, thus leading to them being more open to your teaching. Looking at your post history, you are clearly rubbing people the wrong way with how you are "boldly proclaiming" your faith. You don't have to seek divisiveness. You can be loving and respectful of differences while still "boldly proclaiming" your faith and I guarantee you more people will respond positively (and thus be more willing to respect you and take your posts into consideration). What good does it do anyone to make remarks that you KNOW will cause others to react negatively? Just so you can call them out a "worldly, soulish Christian"? It doesn't matter if you are called to evangelize, teach, or crunch numbers in a 9-5 job.

Again, I am not saying that kittens and rainbows should pop out of your mouth every time you speak. But, tact and respect are just...common sense.

"My main objective in this thread has become a challenge to cause others to dig a little deeper with God so as to experience a greater measure of the fullness of the stature of Christ within their spirit and not to settle for anything less !"

Fair enough. Be honest, what is the BEST WAY to approach this challenge? You cannot guilt, scare, or argue someone into being a true man/woman of God. Heaven is not a place full of people who were scared of Hell. You have to love God and believe in Christ. I have never seen antagonistic remarks lead to this heart change. I have, however, seen respect, listening, tact, and honest and open dialogue without judgment lead to this.

I truly hope that you will take this as constructive criticism and assess how you address others. It is a FAR different thing for the King of Kings to rebuke someone than it is for you or I.

Again, I apologize for any judgments or insults I sent your way.

First of all, don’t worry about offending me because I have died. You cannot offend a dead person, right ? I would much prefer a person to speak openly and honestly from their heart than to hear someone covering up their guile with words of deception.

As for carnality, I am sorry but this is easy to identify. It is what it is and I am compelled to call for what it is. I have seen and experienced enough of a measure of truth to easily recognize that which is in opposition in this world.

As for rebukes, don’t you think it is silly for you to rebuke me for rebuking others based upon the premise that rebuking is wrong ? Paul, speaking by the Holy Spirit told Timothy to rebuke certain people sharply this should allow your natural mind to drop the “Your not Jesus so you cannot rebuke someone” concept. This is a cheap remark on your part. Sorry, but it is. If iron is to sharpen iron, then men must rebuke in addition to encouraging, admonishing and etc. You don’t have to be the person of Jesus Himself, you merely have to be His and abiding in Him and He in you…

I can recite numerous examples in scripture where we are told to do this very thing. If you are in ministry you should know this. With your mindset Christ would have no body at all, just the head. I can assure you that God desires very much a body to effect His will upon the earth. If you say a man cannot rebuke then that means God cannot rebuke. God chooses to work through man and in doing so He thus has a body. The reason you insist that I nor any man can rebuke or do certain things as such is because you do not fully understand the concept of the Lord’s body. I am not trying to insult you I am merely stating fact. To merely insult or offend someone is never my intent.

Furthermore, it is unwise to use generalizations in regards to how we should respond or interact with others as you and others do here with me. This is utilizing the soul power with it’s natural mind, will and emotions so as to discern right from wrong. We should all know by now that this has it’s basis in the tree of the knowledge of right and wrong. This is fundamentally the wrong way. This is us deciding right and wrong via the powers of the soul. This is why Jesus said we MUST deny ourselves so that we can begin to walk in the spirit rather than via the soul. The soul is corrupted with the flesh and the self and is always in contact with Satan and the world. This makes the soul untrustworthy ! The only sure thing is to walk via the spirit which is one with the Spirit ! (Walk in the spirit and you will not carry out the desires of the flesh.) The Spirit is always 100% right. Our part is to subjugate our soul to our spirit wherein the Lord resides and defer all rights and wrongs to Him. This takes years of practice but it is a must.

I know you don’t realize it but you are applying the thoughts, concepts and precepts of men (from the soul) in your application of spiritual things. This is not proper and that is why Paul emphasized that he did come to men with superiority of speech and the like (which is via the soul) but rather he came to them in demonstration of the Spirit and power so that it would have it’s full effect and that their faith would not rest upon the wisdom of the soul’s of men but rather upon the power of God.

Many Christians today remain as babies precisely because they do rely upon the powers of the souls of Christian teachers and preachers rather than upon the power of God. When people use their own thoughts, concepts and abilities to deliver the gospel or to minister Christ to others they actually negate the cross of Christ as Paul said. Do you fully understand the cross of Christ ? The cross is a very great negative in the universe but is an absolute must. Read 1 Corinthians concerning this and open your heart and mind to the Spirit to give you understanding regarding the place and the role of the cross as it applies here to the administration of the gospel. If you follow the principle of the cross to your preaching it will be like applying water to the word before starting the fire. The result will thus require the power of God for the results, right ? Any man can pick out some seasoned kindling and maybe even soak it in starter fluid and strike a match and obtain fire. With the proper application of the cross however, you are like using green wood soaked in water. This affords God the avenue by which He can demonstrate His power in calling into being that which did not exist.

You however, are like most today who try to help God out which in reality is a great disservice to God and His power. If it is man’s power (via his soul) than the cross of Christ is made void. Herein it is you and not He at all. I will have to trust you will seek the Lord in considering this message of the cross so as to give you insight into it’s great and powerful mystery. You might also refer to the prophet who first soaked the wood in water before calling on the Lord to bring down fire from heaven. This too is the principle of the cross.

Remember the Lord’s words that we must deny ourselves (soul lives), take up our cross, and follow Him.

FWIW, OKCThunder I just have to say that you lose all credibility with me when you wish to tout your mind’s concept of natural love that you like to believe about yourself while condemning me for telling and speaking the truth about the state and the reality of Christianity (in general in this country) while completing ignoring something in my OP that a truly loving person would have seen and acknowledged foremost, which was my prayer request for my mother. You ignore the prayer request in favor of attacking me for something that your natural mind cannot accept.

I was initially reluctant to point that out for fear that it would appear that I was USING my mother to make a point. I am only compelled to do so now because not only do you continue to ignore this in showing a very real lack of empathy which would reveal itself out of the true love of Christ but you wish to continue to lift yourself up as some sort of higher loving individual in attacking my words of truth and then on top of that we have someone such as imasoonergal also praising you for your “appearance” of love while she also personally “misses” my prayer request and obviously missing the fact that you did the same as well.

It shows how shallow is the love of natural men. If someone comes to you in his own name, you all will easily accept him, but when one comes in the name of the truth, you cannot receive it or him and feel compelled to speak out against such a one. Do you even understand this word of truth? Do you even know this scripture?

Turn to your spirit if you can, and consider the following scripture ;
“Little children, let us not love in word or with tongue, but in deed and truth.”

The natural man and his mind are so shallow that he can think him self quite loving if he says words of love to others or acts “nice” to them. True love is only possible through the Lord Jesus Christ as all spiritual things are from Him, through Him and to Him. We can only experience and express true love through Him being lived out as our life via our spirit. I can always tell where someone is coming from, whether they are speaking from themselves or whether they are speaking through the Lord. You do not have this true discernment because you rely upon your natural mind and the soul’s weak perceptions for your judgments. Your mind’s natural concepts are your basis for such determinations and they are useless for spiritual things. This is why Jesus boldly said, “My judgments are just because I do not seek my own”. Natural men seek their own discernment based upon their natural mind’s concepts, biasis’ and etc. If we turn to and defer to the Lord however in our spirit, only then can we have clarity in judgment.

I can see however that you and sooner gal are both believers it’s just that you still walk according to the natural as mere men and not as the godmen that you are in Christ. I am not attacking you, just stating fact while hoping and praying that the Lord will bring you to a fuller knowledge of the truth in Christ Jesus.

Unfortunately, most believers have not been even fully versed on the differentiallity of the mode and source of our being via our soul and spirit. Most do not even know the meaning of soul and spirit much less having made the transformation and transition of a walk from one to the other. This is a very basic and fundamental thing which if one does not experience, he cannot even truly begin to walk in the spirit and know truly spiritual things. This is a very deep and serious subject and I truly hope and pray the Lord will bring you to the knowledge and experience of a walk in your spirit as He has graciously done with me. I do not imply that I have obtained perfection but that I have at least made this transition of life and am on the journey for more of this eternal life ! I wish the same for all…

Sure... funny thing is you are enjoying a world and a society that is being kept morally in check by the salt of Christianity (religion).

If you had your wishes and there was no religious or Christian influence the world would degrade to a level unfit for man.

This is an open topic board and you always have the prerogative to read or write to your heart's desire. If you reject the Lord that is your right and God Himself will honor that. I will respect your wishes as well but that does not give you the right to take away my rights and privilages either.

Godman, you've probably burned too many bridges to come in here asking for prayers. Then you turn around and start going off on people right after asking for these prayers?!?! Unreal...

And to answer your question, no, Christians aren't supposed to be in the majority in this country. That's the great thing about this country. You can worship whatever you want. The only thing screwing that up is people like you who talk about all our freedoms and then turn around and talk about how this is supposed to be a christian nation and how people on a freaking message board are talking about things you don't like. What a hypocrite. Seems nothing has changed with you

I have posted on your attitude before. One thing that is clear, is that people who don't tow your line, you judge harshly. As a person who works to support the multiple ministries that I am involved with from all walks of life, from here in inner-city work and gang/drug issues and in foreign countries, your type of judgmental attitude hinders more than it helps.

I am not going to get into a scripture-counter scripture debate with you. But I deal with the real damage your type of attitude causes on too regular of a basis. It really isn't your business, but on a part-time basis, I have spent 20+ hours a week studying and teaching inductive Bible study along with living it out often with people who are in rehab or incarcerated. And have for many of my 62 years. Then I have my out-of-country passion to disciple Mayans, with my next trip in August. I only say that to inform you that if you want to attack me as being the problem, like you have others, I am well aware of who my protector is.

You can judge me as being part of the problem, if you want. It may surprise you, but those that know me know more than you do about the ministries I am involved in.

You are wrong on this!

There is no point in debating this with you until you learn the difference between respect/tact and "always being nice" for the sake of being nice. Until then, good luck.

I value my right to ignore religion all together. I simply make my choices based on how those actions will affect others.